As far as Primes having too much to lose you are right. If they don't continue the same business practices that got them there then they will go out of business. So why change? It has got them to where they are today. It's like Magi said about the good old boy/ girl network. It's alive and well today. The companies I mentioned as 1, 2, and 3. They are primes that have been around for a while. The people running these companies have probably been around since the early days of cable so don't give me this crap about them not being above offering a kickback. It's a reality of this industry. It's how the system works. It has nothing to do with personality or performance, because if most of these people would have to start to do the work right they would have no idea where to start. One other thing about these old dogs, they got there by screwing everyone on their way to the top. They've all lied cheated and stole to get where they are now.
As for in-house people, Magi is right, 99% of them are dumb asses that if they got laid off they would have a hard time competing with teenagers for a job at Taco Bell. The people in-house that know anything are so beat down by the corruption that they don't care anymore. Out of the 400 people or so that work in the AT&T region where I work, I would safely say that 25-30 of them have a clue. The other 375 if they all got together and tried to figure something out they would still come up with the wrong answer.
By the way the going rate up here is around 5 to 7% plus all the little hunting and fishing trips these guys get.
> Seems to me that you must be new to the industry most primes
> have to much to lose to risk offering a kickback. The people giving out the work do it on a performance an personality. Win some lose some. I've had a contract in hand for 2000 miles
> of upgrade and be 10 miles into it and have the mso call me and tell me to bring in all parts and stop work because of a change in planning. If you were dumb enough to go out and
> buy or rent for one of these jobs then you are bankrupt on the
> spot. Quite crying and grow up buy your epuip own it and be waiting for the job when it comes along then maybe you can compete with the old dogs. Don't begrudge them theirs just becuase you can't get yours in two years they've been after
> theirs for twenty years in 18 more you might be there
>
> > It seems to me that there IS a lot of kickback BS in the cable/telephone industry.If I recall correctly "regulation" used to be our biggest enemy. We all anticipated " deregulation" to make it all better.It's not working, we're working longer days for less money.
> > If Uncle Sam and the FCC and the FTC can dictate ( as they definitely have done in the past)the economy of our industry, controling the working man, then why don't they step in NOW and put a stop to this crap.
> > There will be alot of people(good and bad) are likely to lose everything they have over this Adelphia scandal.Some of us have tied up alot of money to do this work for them. I'd bet that the Rikas themselves are going to get away with this. With all their $$$ and a fancy lawyer.Who knows?
> > Some will lose their equipment or trucks, some will probably lose their homes.Some maybe worse.
> > And the rest of the major players are going to drop their prices, counting on someone , in desperation, to give in and work cheaper. Which in turn makes the next man do the same thing.Talk about a crumbling pyramid!
> > If we've ever needed gov't intervention, we need it now.
> >
> > > I'm not sure what the standard going rate is because it seems to vary from system to system. But I do have a fairly firm grasp on how it usually works. In the first place you must first achieve "legend" status within your respective MSO in order to earn the right to squander shareholder value in awarding kickbacks. It is just as important that you report to another "legend" who has more to lose by exposing, or hindering you, than he/she does by actually earning the salary, and bonus, which they are paid. It certainly does not hurt one bit to have these people surrounded by a bunch of folks who have long since been promoted way beyond their capabilities (the "Peter Principle" times ten), who all ultimately report to intentionally clueless division presidents or other glib corporate leader types. And if anyone in mid or upper level management actually tries to make a positive difference toward the success of the overall organization then all of these yellow bellies are immediately alerted that it is again time to sell out another portion of their diminished self respect and chutzpah (that means balls, right?) in shuffling together long enough to brand THIS person as the unqualified, ineffective, or corrupt "problem" and then drive them out or neutralize them as quickly as possible. This is how it has "theoretically" always worked in cable but a new day may just be dawning for some of these idiots: AOL closed at $51.96 on 5/1/01 and was down to $19.39 on 5/1/02; A.T.& T. closed at $22.28 on 4/30/01 and was down to $13.12 on 4/30/01; Adelphia (talk about problems at the top!!!) closed at $36.63 on 5/01/01 and was down to $6.95 on 5/01/02; Charter closed at $21.41 on 4/30/01 and was down to $8.19 on 4/30/02; and even Comcast slid from $43.91 on 4/30/01 to $26.75 on 4/30/02. In all fairness, a proportionately small number of relatively recent changes have been made within the ranks of some of these companies. But the good old boy/girl kickback system is still alive and well and we have been blessed with a fresh new generation of greedy, immoral, and generally soulless primes to keep it stoked. Will anything change? It all depends on how truly Enron-like the Adelphia saga plays out and how much more aggressive Charlie Ergen gets with his various alliances among CATV competitors. The Cable Television industry is as much an unstoppable monopoly as the Titanic was an unsinkable ship. Judging from the over one dozen + shareholder lawsuits which are currently pending against Adelphia, there are at least a few concerned stockholders who would like some answers about apparently irresponsible CATV management decisions. What do you suppose would happen if they starting probing elsewhere..? And what if they completely overlook kickbacks and go straight to over reported subscribers and under reported (a methodology similar to an off balance partnership) bad debt? Charter has already 'fessed up to some extent on this but the others have so far remained silent. Watch out for icebergs and grab some life preservers for your families!
> > >
> > > > What is the going rate for kickbacks? This is an important part of this industry. This is the only way all of these bad Primes and Subs stay in business. Just in the last 2 weeks I have seen companies get caught doing bad walkout and what happens? AT&T rewards them with more work, After all it was not the Primes fault that there employees were not leaving the motel to do there mapping. To top it all off after they gave this company more work, they hired another company to redo the stuff company # 1 screwed up and AT&T decided it wasn't in there best interest to back charge company # 1. So they bring in company # 2 and because they want to make sure that it gets done right this time they hire company # 3 to walk the same area at the same time to make sure it is right. Well guess what? It's still f***ed up so they bring back company # 1 because all of a sudden they do such good work and the Management in this system gets kickback. So whats the going rate for kickbacks. This is not the only place this is happening in AT&T. No wonder there stock price is at 13 and falling. I get a kick when I hear the system people crying about there retirement plans and then they turn around and pay 5 times what it should cost to get the job done.
